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“Socialy Awkward”

I fisrt took note of this turn during my church’s bible study for young adults (18-30). In trueth I wasn’t really paying atention to anything and was just drifting away, as I always do in most group settings (i sort of drift into myself, and close the world out around me). anyways i just remember hearing the group leader say “…. and some people are socially awkward…” As soon as he said this it was like a bell flicked on in my head, i knew he wasn’t talking about me, but I completly felt that way. So immediately, after he said this I pointed to myself in a self comidic sort of way (i did it without really thinking about it, was more like a reflex, sort of my way of breaking the ice when the conversation in a room gets to deap for my comfort). Anyways this caused a little much needed laughter in the room, with the group leader trying to asure me that i wasn’t socialy awkward. In truth, it dosn’t matter if he truely believed i wasn’t or if he did but was trying to be nice, the fact is, it was truely how i feal, every moment of the day when i have to interact with people of my age group, especially when in large groups.

I often find myself in situations like today, where i’m in a group of people my age (22ish), I’m kind of the outsider watching them interact. And one thing about Canadians, is they can be quite witty, and are in generally comedic people in my opinion (or atleast in comparision asians). So i’m watching interact, then they’d say somthing to me, and i rarly know how to reply. Theres a thing in Canada called sarcasim, it can be a wonderful thing, unless your like me, and have a hard time detecting it! And i’m not say i have no sence of humor, in trueth, when i’m with friends who i know really well (all of them also tcks) i’m often the life of the party. But with my “canadian” buddies, I just don’t know how to react to them, and often don’t really understand whats going on because of all the cultural refrenses they make. So i just become that idiot who laughs when they laugh, not because i think that the joke is funny, but because i don’t get it! Well my main problem is in group settings, when i’m with just one friend, I’m able to interact a little beter, perhaps it’s because i don’t feel as much social presure to impress when i’m only around one person.

Shaking hands

Other then my struggle in group settings, knowing what to say, and saying the right things so i don’t sound stupid, but I also struggle greatly with physical contact! To exsplain, my parents are Canadian, but I was raised in Taiwan, and learned Taiwanese rules of greatings, and departures. I remember when i was old enough to care about not seeming wierd, I actually did some self studying about how to interact with westreners. I had to teach myself how to shake hands properly (not to soft, not to hard) so that I come across as a confident young man. I also took note, not to offer my hand to a woman, unless she offerd first (I learned from some very conservitive southren baptist course on how to be a gentalmen). So now that i’v lived in canada i’ve had to really master how and when to “shake hands”. The problem, its a reflex for me, someone in church might reach their hand out to grabe a coffee, but my brain tells my arm to shakehands, when thats not what me not the other perosn plan on doing. It can be extreemly embaracing!

being asked “hows it going?”

for me it seems, it is never going well, which really sucks, since i find it extreemly hard to lie, even when it’s to be an answer to a redundant question. I know when people say “hows it going?” or “whatsup?” its just that their saying “hi” and the answer should be something like “good, how about you?” without actually wanting to know the answer, but i always take “hows it going?” as a starter to a conversation. And like I said, Its always going badly with me, so I end up sounding like that guy whos always complaining about everything. So i’ve learned, short answers like, “well…. its been better – (quickly followed by) hows it going with you?” so that they can answer my question without having to do the polite thing of asking me what wrong.

Hugging

dear lord, I’m still practicing at this. For those who don’t know, people don’t hug in Taiwan, even handshakes are much rarer. anyways, The fisrt time in my teen life (as a kid, i probably didn’t have such a probblem with hugging) that i remember giving someone a hug, was when my oldest sister, was leaving at the airport, on her way to repaitriate into canada (for unviesrity). So i sort of learned, to hug when it was a family member who I wasn’t going to see for a long time (more then a year), or when a family member I hadn’t seen for a long time, comes back. Then I went to canada in my mid teens and had to learn to hug my aunts, which seemed wierd, since i wasn’t really close to most of them at the time. So i learned to hug extened family members, or friends of my parents who where like family. Now after living in Canada a little more then 4 years (too long!) I’ve learned that hugs are like handshakes in many social circles, but i feel very uncomfortable at both! I remember being really surprised at when one of my coworkers who i hadn’t seen in a few weeks – when she saw me, she pritty much jumped into my arms, I was quite shocked, I had no idea that friends hugged like that. I’m not saying I didn’t enjoy it, we both had an unoffical “thing” for one anouther, and that hug, made me feel so close to her, It was a very intimate feeling for me. I don’t remember ever feeling so close to someone, its a shame I never asked her out (i always figured, I didn’t have enough in common with non-tck canadians). So anyways, the hug, for me, is something I don’t feel very comfortable with, unless it’s with a family member, or a girl i’m close with, so its very hard for me to hug. I usally just react to what the other person dose, if they open thier arms that means “hug”. kind of like a robot reaction, same as the “handshake”.

Kissing

I plan to go to spain next year and in the future LAmerica, and I hear that people kiss each other on the cheeks. I don’t know what i’ll do, since in the culture I was raised in, husbends and wives don’t even kiss in public, so this whole casual kissing for greeting people and saying good bye, is terifyingly foreign to me!

I often think my sociall problems are more then just the fact I’m a tck, but I see how growing up in no body contact sociaty, and then moving to body contact sociaty (perhaps Zoe can relate to the opposit of my situation! haha) can have a major affect on me, and tcks with similar exsperainaces. Its strange, I’ve very uncomfortable with bodycontact (i often flinch someone touches me, wether on acident or on purpose), but strangly, at the same time I feel starved for it and crave it. So i don’t know is this just a people thing, or is it a tck thing, or is it just me? haha.

please share. :-)

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  • smarandavelichi
    I get the same as all of your..Firstly I grew up in Romania where people kiss on the cheek when they meet eachother..my aunt actually kisses me on my forehead as well as on my lips sometimes. But anyway at the age of 12 i moved to the uk..where everybody hugs..the first few times people seemed(in my head) they were gonna kiss me but actually gave me hugs..so eventually i learned. I think i accidentally kissed some on the cheek which was awkward for them. So then, for 7 years i got used to hugging some people. But in the UK not everyone hugs..just some people..maybe close friends and whatnot..and the rest just wave or say hello verbally.


    Then last summer I spent 3 months in Chile..which was back to romanian customs! every morning all my coworkers kissed me on both cheeks..every evening when we said goodbye they did the same! it was so so weird! i never initiated it..but when they did it i did it too of course..i had to..their culture..their rules. It was so strange to me to do the kissing thing again..especially since they do it way more than in Romania..as far as i remember. Cuz they kiss every single person...that get SO tedious!! EVERY DAY!!
    Anyway with a good friend i had in chile..she realised my customs were different..as I never made the effort to kiss her hello...so she never did it to me ..it was really strange ..even when we met after a long time..i huged her for some reason but it was still strange..it's like we are so unsure of how to act..and she kind of like assumes maybe that i don`t like kissing or hugging or any kind of contact just because i am weird and unsure about it..and i get shy not knowing what to do. So even after i got used to the people at work kissing me every day..it got so weird because she didn`t do it..kinda felt left out lol..
    ooh and when i got to chile ..I had come from the states where i spent a year..and in the states they shake hands more i think..from my experience there anyway..so i kept extending my hand but realising no one is reacting and they just lean to kiss me on the cheek..so so confusing! I`m so glad i`m not the only one annoyed by that:)

    About the joke thing..usually when i meet someone new i try to crack jokes..that`s my way of getting comfortable with that person..making them laugh..but usually it`s hard to stop making stupid jokes..and they get really boring after a while..i have to learn when to stop..or change my approach somehow. I enjoy it though..as long as people get my sense of humor
  • A.D.Watkins
    And you just dragged me kicking and screaming out of lurker status...

    YES! I know this feeling!

    I constantly feel like I am just watching the people around me for cues.

    None of my childhood cultures were as conservative as yours but I too have problems with the hugging, casual displays of affection, or body contact (bumping shoulders, digging elbows, etc). I keep thinking to myself that I should be able to logically think about what is and isn't called for but it just doesn't work. I'm occasionally given to grandiose gestures or expansive statements (I blame the islands, the caribbean is very expressive) but physical contact is surprisingly hard for me to initiate or recieve.
  • Hey Zoe. :)
    I've always been interested in Psychology. Just not too keen on taking it up as a career at the moment. It's very useful in so many ways though.
    And yes, I am one of those things known as a 'banana' so I'd be grateful if it was in english. ^^ Thanks for looking it up!
  • Zoe
    The Chinese title of the book is "??????" meaning "Which type of person are you?"

    The author is Psychology Profesor from Stanford University

    Enneagram

    http://www.enneagram.com/ <- This is it! See the pic (Circle and the arrows?)

    Btw, I wrote "doubter", it's actually "Loyal Skeptist"

    And "Hedonist" is actually "Epicure" here.....

    =)

    Hope this help many!!!
  • Zoe
    XD!!

    Mish.wsl

    You made the same mistake I always make XDD
    Right that Selando is better? XD!!!

    Two other things in common ^^ (Hi5)

    Memoirs of a Geisha and that u r interested in that Psychology I talked 'bout XD
    OMGosh~~~ I'm SO~~ Glad!! XD

    I read it in Chinese, however, I'm sure that it was translated from English... Let me look it up for u and come back 2 u later ^^
  • Oops - SeNlando! Sorry!
  • Hey Selando. :) Yeah, I did eventually get used to it. But then I moved to Australia where the number of immigrants means that greeting through body contact is a bit strange. They like their space here.
    I've never really thought about how people would react to my way of greeting though, so that's something new to think about. Usually I extend a hand, and most people generally seem to be okay with that. Occassionally, I'll get the over-eager greeter and it becomes apparent when they move in for a hug, but I offer my hand instead. xD

    Hi Zoe. Memoir's of a Geisha suddenly has a whole new meaning for me. ;) It's always been one of my favourite movies, but now that you explain it like that, it makes sense as to why it's made my top ten!
    And what book is that that you're reading, the one with the psychology? It sounds interesting, I'd love to have a read.
  • Zoe
    Quotes from "Memoirs of a Geisha":

    "Dreams can be such dangerous things; they smolder on like a fire does, and sometimes consume us completely."

    My dream was: If I go back to Tw, certain bad things that existed in Nicaragua wouldn't anymore... (Although, SOME bad things DID cease existing after I came)

    "I don't think any of us can speak frankly about pain until we are no longer enduring it"

    "If you'd asked me why I wanted these things, I would have answered, why does a ripe persimmon taste delicious? Why does wood smell smoky when it burns?"

    "To become a geisha . . . well, that was hardly a purpose in life. But to be a geisha . . . I could see it now as a STEPPING-STONE TO SOMETHING ELSE"

    I am wondering what's the "Something else" I can get by using the stepping-stone TCKness....

    "Some people have difficulty telling the difference between something great and something they've simply heard of"

    -Sayuri

    "Water never waits. It changes shape and flows around things, and finds the secret paths no one else has thought about."

    As a TCK, no matter what, never waste time on "dreams".... Live each day as if there isn't a different lifestyle. But at the same time, have hope that there IS and you WILL live a different lifestyle, in the future. This is so tricky... but it ROCKS. ???!!!!

    "We don't become geisha because we want our lives to be happy; we become geisha because we have no choice."

    (Just change "geisha" to "TCK" XD!!!)

    -Mameha

    "You can't pretend you have no influence at all. It's your duty to use what influence you have" -Nobu

    "I never seek to defeat the man I'm fighting, I seek to defeat his confidence" -Admiral Yamamato Isoroku
  • Zoe
    In that book (the Nine types of persons)
    It teaches u how to improove ur situation
    It points out the weaknesses of each, etc. etc..

    And it really helps. At least it helped me.

    Okay, I'm just sharing a bit about "my own" story...
    Anyone, read if u want..

    I relate myself super well with little Chiyo from that novel "Memoirs of a Geisha"
    Bc she, same as me, move from a smaller town to a big city at the age of nine (OMGosh! What a coincidence!!!)

    There are SO many good quotes that I think, for TCKs similar as me, would be helpful....


    I'll give some for u, for free =D

    (Oh, first, Stop the "self-pity complex". Even though I still feel/think that it IS "bad luck" to have to been hurt for so many times by being a TCK, however, KNOWING this is different from having "Self-Pity Complex". Both are important: Knowing we do have some bad luck to encounter those ugly things AND avoiding Self-Pity Complex. If one is insightful enuf, they can tell the diff..)

    I just realized (these days) while phoning a Taiwanese TCK (I met her here on TCKID.com). Now I've been calling her and discussed some TCKness... And I had a conclusion after a call... I clearly realized that it WAS Self-Pity Complex that made my life even "Heller" than it already had to be!!! However, I don't blame myself, bc I simply was too young, and "didn't know better". Right now, I am leaving that SP Complex behind.... (Oh, ppl don't know, so don't judge, it's all inside. "What's essential is invisible to the eye")

    Back to Geishas...

    They don't choose to become Geishas... (MOST of them, esp. back in time) Same as us, we don't choose to become TCKs... (we were too young to know what it really mean by being one)
  • Zoe
    I envy those Asians who CAN reply to those funny jokes.... They fit in so much better than those who can't............ ='(

    I think has to do with Personality.... ='(

    It's not cultural anymore..................

    Also, about being the "observer" and not really "interacting" even when ppl are all from ur age................

    Uh.... I get that part too
    Bc I'm like that too.
    Maybe only a slight amount less than u.....

    You know what? "That" (observer vs interacter) is so Psychology

    I mean, I read a book (a awesome one) catagorizing ppl into nine types. And we can be three (out of nine)

    Years ago when I did it, I was: The Romantic (always thinking that u need those thing that u do not have, in ur life in order to be happy) , The Observer (you observe others interacting but never interact and join them!) and The "Doubter" (means u have to proove evthing b4 ur sure of anything...)

    Ppl DO change... so after yrs, I did the same test again, and I became (same) Romantic (first place), Observer (second place) but my third place CHANGED. Now my third place is The Hedonist....

    I sort of now why.... Things happened in my life and... well... also bc I found out that my father... yes... my father... is the opposite of Hedonist. He is such a serious guy and really think that evone should feel guilty if they have any type of pleasure. It's all about duty, but ur not suppose to "have fun"...

    "Repression provokes rebellion"

    So as long as my father can't control me anymore, I became a Hedonist. I crave having fun and treating myself well. Only bc my father is too the opposite.........

    Anyways....

    I just think Psychology is really important for all of us. And each of us should study (at least the basic) bc it simply help us to cope with life!

    I think, according to my observation on you, I think ur The Observer AND The Romantic too. Same as me. (The word Romantic means more of the lifestyle, not really Romantic as in Romance)

    The reason why I think ur a Romantic, the traces are... u "thought" that if u don't really get the Taiwaneses, then you may get ppl IF YOU GO BACK TO CANADA... (I just remember that sth like that was what u had implied) Like u thought u may get Canadian girls better than Taiwanese girls.... (b4 u actually moved back to Canada)

    I know some other TCK who is very similar as u in this sense, not mentioning myself. I also known some other TCKs who aren't like this. And I'm actually jealous of them = =. I think it made their life easier. They don't think by going to another place would do any better... No matter how bad they hate the recent place, they know, b4 I, just stay and STOPP DREAMING....

    I am sharing my own life experience and really hope it's for ur good and only try to help u here. I hope I don't offend anyone by "analyzing anyone's Psych" XD!!!! I'm sorry, but I only think that studying it simply help us, anyone, to... cope??
  • Zoe
    Preston!

    Sorry I'm too tired now to finish the whole thing.
    I am having MY own break down right now too here...

    But... Oh My Gosh!

    We do have more and more things in common!!!

    About "English speaking ppl are more comedic" and the sarcasm and know what to say to reply!!! Oh, Gosh! I SO GET U!!!!!

    Really!

    And me? Same as you!!! I do NOT know how to answer them!!!!

    Never!!!!!!!!

    I went to an American school, so I encountered situations like those ALL the time!!!
    And I just felt! Hate to say this... but "Too Asian" (is the words that pops out of my mind now)

    When I was in the American High School... I alway felt that I was "TOO ASIAN" to "accept" their sarcasm and even "reply" with sth "funny"....

    Maybe the first few yrs I couldn't "get" them
    But, trust me, I learned after the yrs... However, I've never got to the point (And I now genuinely think that I NEVER WILL) trully "ENJOY" their "comedic.... thingy??? and KNOW HOW TO REPLY!!!

    Uh!.... Maybe I KNOW.... Just that I never will....
    It just isn't my taste....
    Or maybe... I get their jokes and laugh FOR REAL (Trully thinking they're SO FUNNY) However, I can't TELL a joke like those!
  • Senlando
    @ mish.wsl
    "I almost froze on the spot the first time when one of the girls at my South African school greeted me like that."

    lol, the first and only time someone tried to kiss me on the cheek, i reacted in a similar way, but what made it worse i didn't know where to turn my head so almost got in on my lips. I'm really going to have to do something about that, before i go an my exchange program in Spain.

    I think I would have to consider Canada, a semi-body-contact-country, since people don't kiss here, and only hug people they know fairly well. Also in my part of Canada, (same as most big cities), it's extremely international, my Church is at least 60% recent immigrants from all over, so one has to be extra careful, how one greets other people.

    I think my main problem is like Dan said, figuring out, if the other person is comfortable with body contact or not.

    but another problem I've encountered, is when I went back to Taiwan, 2 years ago, I saw my best friend (Taiwanese) for the first time in 2 years, I wasn't sure how to greet him. I had an urge to give him a bro-hug(something I'm reluctant to do most of the time {like most guys} but when it comes to best friends I hadn't seen in a few years, I feel it's a necessary sign of friendship or brotherhood), but stopped myself because I know it would be cultural very strange for him. And i thought that a handshake was way to formal (kind of business like in my opinion) so we had to settle for a friendly wave and a verbal greeting. Which is too bad cause I believe our friendship (I've know him since I was 4) deserved a more familiar greeting. I've found the lack of body contact, to be just as uncomfortable as body contact greetings. It seems I'm indecisive, and being indecisive, on how to greet, makes it all that much harder.

    @ Taiwanese TCKs (or TCKs from similar cultures)
    I really can't for the life of me, remember how friends are supposed to greet, even though I've lived in Taiwan for 18 years. As far as I can remember, there's usually no body contact. Mostly just a wave, a node, and a smile. Is this true, or have I just forgotten how we greet? Perhaps I've lived in Canada for too long and am forgetting important details, or perhaps people acted differently around me. So my questions, for clarification purposes, how do Taiwanese greet?
  • Uncle Dan
    Indonesia is a non-contact culture, BUT I went to a British International School there, which had a large number of Europeans, which are largely contact cultures. I grew up with two kisses to the cheeks as a common greeting to the opposite sex. Then I went to the US, where people tend to be very touchy about personal space. Then I went to Switzerland where three kisses to the cheeks are normal. It's a bit confusing altogether, but I generally prefer contact cultures.

    Regarding seriousness... Indonesia was about as laid back as it got when it came to day to day life. There are few people more laid back than they. In America, I found they were pretty serious, but tended to work in extremes: you were either very serious, or very much not. Switzerland followed the European model: Work hard, play hard.

    I'm comfortable in general with social situations, but then have my preferences. For example, I feel estranged in American partylife, which exudes an entirely different atmosphere from what I'm used to. It's something I *can* do, but not what I prefer. I feel I grew up with a pseudo-European social life, with a few touches of Asian, and that special flux that is Expatriate living.

    I'm comfortable with body-contact, though I've found it can be difficult to judge whether others are too. If you're comfortable with body-contact, and the person you're talking to isn't, they can get weirded out for the wrong reasons.

    I think I've reached a point in my life where I really don't care if I get left out, because I feel I can choose my own crowd if I really have to, and I can get along with anyone more or less.

    To the shutting of my mind... I admit: occasionally. In, for example, the situation I'm not comfortable with (American party life) I find it just... not fun, and have retreated a bit because I'm just not enjoying it. But I think the important thing is to make the effort, and not to retreat and cut your losses too early.
  • Weird as it sounds, I am in complete accordance with you.
    I also tend to be the quiet 'socially awkward' one in large groups where I don't really know anyone. Yet I can turn into a complete chatterbox when I'm at my most comfortable!
    I spoke to a friend of mine about this, since I am at uni now and told him I didn't really know how to fit in with the people there. How I tended to be more introverted with people I didn't know. He didn't believe me, needless to say since I've always acted like an extrovert around him! Same goes for an old friend who also goes to my uni now. I told her I was introverted in my lectures and she didn't believe me.

    In terms of the greeting problems - I sort of had your situation, only it wasn't as awkward for me getting used to them. I used to go to an international school in Malaysia, where everything was very open. So when I moved to South Africa, it wasn't so bad.
    The handshake thing was something I just had to get used to, since as a child, you don't normally go around shaking people's hands!
    Cheek kisses are a little strange though, I'll admit it. I'm used to hugging my closest friends, but having to use a hug as a form of greeting was definitely strange! And as for the kissing, I almost froze on the spot the first time when one of the girls at my South African school greeted me like that.

    I guess the best solution for if you prefer as little body contact as possible, is to just extend your hand and offer a handshake. But be the one to initiate it so that the other person doesn't try to lean in for a hug/kiss. At least then there's only hand to hand contact and no uncomfortable closeness!
  • Senlando
    ops posted that on accident,... questions continued.

    are you comfortable what kind of social situations your comfortable or not comfortable with?

    how do you feel about body contact?

    do you often feel left out of groups, or do you feel your missing half of whats going on?

    do you shut yourself into your own mind, while your friends socialize around you?

    any other things you'd like to share. or things you can relate to. I'm going to end now, since it's to late for me to think rationally!

    night!
  • Senlando
    sorry my post was badly organized (like always). but what here's a few questions for tcks.

    how have the social laws of your various cultures, impacted you.
    did you go from a contact-society to a non-contact-society (or vis versa)?
    did you go from a serious culture, to a layed back culture?
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